An Interview With: Nadine Benjamin

Nadine Benjamin is a lyric soprano who grew up in Brixton South London. She is currently an English National Opera (ENO) Harewood Artist and the first black British soprano to release a solo opera album ('Love & Prayer'). She’s performed as Musetta in Puccini's La Bohème: Alice Grahame (the Londonist) gave the production 4 out of 5 stars and wrote "Nadine Benjamin steals the show as a comical extrovert Musetta". La Bohème is Nadine's second ENO production, her debut role was Clara in Gershwin's Porgy and Bess. Nadine graciously agreed to be interviewed: she shared so many nuggets of wisdom and information that we decided to print the interview largely as spoken, so grab a cuppa! (Photo credit: Devon Cass)

What was growing up in South London and attending school like for you?

It was quite difficult. I was bullied a lot and so found it very hard to concentrate on being in school and studying. I also recognised that I loved singing. I would sing in the playground and people in primary school would say "sing this, sing this" so there was this kind of double reality. I loved English! I am a secret writer really and I also had my voice, so writing and singing were a lifeline for me. While I didn't do quite as well as I'd like to have done in school I had this gift which helped me to stay focused.

Did you attend local schools?

Yes, I attended quite a few primary schools. As a family we moved quite a lot but around south London.

Was there a particular point in primary or secondary school when things settled down and you weren't bullied?

No, I was bullied the whole way through primary and secondary school.  Unfortunately that was my life's journey. I went to college as I had to retake my exams because of the way I had been learning (which) was disjointed because of the bullying. (What) was interesting was being at school and leaving school with grades ranging  from D to E and going to college, doing retakes, and getting grades ranging from A to B because I didn't have the same relationships and actually took the retakes in a more pleasant environment. 

So what was the turning point?

I left home and had to fend for myself.   I realised that if I didn't look after myself, nobody else would.

When you left school did you do a youth training program?

Yes. I attended a YTS (Youth Training Scheme) in Business Administration and this led to my employment in a merchant bank in the city where I excelled because I was in a  structured environment and I was like a sponge. Structure is important as I am dypraxic (Nadine didn't know this at the time). I was able to excel really quickly. I was an asset to the company and my time there was extremely productive.

Did you choose the Admin course or was it something you 'fell into'?

No, when I was leaving secondary school I had a teacher who said she wanted me to go to music college. My mum didn't think that  this was possible and suggested I go onto a YTS Scheme. 

So 'by chance' you went into the field of Corporate Finance?

Yes, I was put on a placement.

Once working in the company how did you progress from entry level?

I was employed as a junior secretary. Within six months of me being there,  the PA to the Head of Corporate Finance said to me "you could do my job blindfolded" and walked out. She walked out on the Friday and on the Monday morning, I just sat in her seat and did her job.  No one ever asked me to move.

Really? So you rose to the occasion?

Yes, My boss became my adoptive father and I became his adoptive daughter.  He took me under his wing. He taught me everything I needed to know from Rights Issues,  Mergers and Acquisitions to wine. He was amazing. I lost him about four years ago and that was a huge loss.  He had given me a sense of 'true north'.

You were asking me a question earlier about what it was like being a woman or a woman of colour (in the male dominated finance field). I didn't ever feel out of place.  I knew I was different and I wasn't threatening their job. I just needed to be great at what I did so (it) made no difference. That was my experience. For me there was no barrier. I was always supported, I was always given promotions and this was how I grew.

Sometimes things happen in our life to propel us. When the PA left you didn't think "no I'll stay where I am", you took the leap and sat in her chair

It felt like the natural thing to do. Her work had to get done and I knew how to do it - so I just got on with it!  That was how it was for me in my head.

The practicality of ...

I'm fairly practical but this is very much a learned behaviour.  I am not someone who expects others to get me where I need to go. However, over the years I have learnt to ask for advice and support.  It is always nice to have others looking out for you and I love looking out for others. There is no point comparing yourself to someone else as this causes a very negative effect on your life. 

That's the world we live in now. There are lots of comparisons and means, especially with social media, for people to feel they need to compare.

Yes, but  we are in control of our minds. When we let others take over our minds we become insecure and feel a loss of control.  If we take care of ourselves,  we don't have to buy into that system. The Matrix is a good film for this. When you think about it, it's not very far off from the way we live now. 

People need to be in control

Absolutely, there's an amazing woman called Dr Ronx and she has a slogan "you cannot be what you cannot see". She is an amazingly talented black doctor who works with kids and has a show on TV at the moment. She is a knockout!

Knowing what you know now and where you are now, what career advice would you give to your younger self?

I would have told myself to get as educated as possible about the subject that I wanted to learn, to live it, breathe it, listen to it and feel it!!! I would have told myself to not listen to all the people who told me "I can't"  and to trust my instincts. I would have learnt accountancy or law to help support my artistic career. Most of all though, I think I would have learnt to play the piano. 

You've not done badly..

No,  even though I was involved in corporate finance where I got commission on the deals and was treated as 'one of the lads', my adoptive father at the time was giving me the opportunity to be like him and I really didn't know what he was offering me. I'd say to a young person if somebody's offering you the chance to learn something different for a period of time allow yourself to take that opportunity because you don't know where it might lead you.  If you are not sure what it involves, ask questions.  Be curious!

How did you juggle singing professionally with working within the finance field?

Well I always sang popular music and this was great for me. I was brought up in the church and it was about having a place of rest, singing was where I could be at peace. I always knew that it was something that was given to me to transcend everything that was going on around me and that singing was my healer. As well as  working, I would go to the studio with the lads at night to record music.  I used to be in a band called 'Solar Plexus'.  It would involve a team of us at a studio in Tooting. It could be soul, garage, pop, drum 'n' bass -  whatever inspired us. We were free artists!

When the opportunity came up for me to sing opera,  I was just about to get a promotion at work. I was on the Trading floor at this time and I just thought "Actually if I don't do this now...".  My boss said to me  "what you are about to do is get a lot of money - you are a bright intelligent girl! What would you really like to do?" I said "I just really want to sing." He said "I will  give you three months - go and see if you can do it.  Your job will be here if you decide you want to come back." I took the leap and never went back. So there was a point where I then had to navigate how I would support myself but it started with that first leap of faith.

Brave to take that leap

Well, when you come from my circumstances you know the only way you can go is up. I have a huge faith as well and I know enough now to know that when you leap you will be caught, but only if you believe.

So how did opera really kick in for you?

Before I left school my music teacher Mrs Lake played me The Queen on the Night's aria from The Magic Flute.   She said "I know you can't go onto music college but before you go I just want you to hear this as I want you to know that you could sing like this one day". It was a seed that was planted for me by a teacher, and it has been growing ever since.

This is partly why I believe in mentorship. An individual then has the opportunity to grow, even unconsciously, without them knowing what opportunities it could create. I suppose that had grown in me so much that when my boss said "are you sure?" I just went for it. Even though I was scared at the same time I thought somebody else had planted it and I had the belief that it was possible. If it was possible why shouldn't I just try and work it out and see if I could do it.

So what is it about opera that draws you in?

So for me it's about expressing myself in the most authentic way possible. It's an art form that allows me to have all of my expression without someone telling me to 'tone it down'. And the mirror of that means that other people watching me can have their experience too

So how did you find your style?

My voice?

Yes

Your voice tells you what your style is. This is why you can't compare. We're already built, I believe the voice is a soul that has a story to tell. Only you come to earth with that gift and only that soul can deliver that gift that you bring. So there's no point comparing yourself with somebody else. The time when people feel agitated is when they do not stay loyal or commit to their own gifts. They don't know how to realise what they have.

And realise that they are enough

Exactly. Though I'm not saying at any point that this is easy, under any circumstances. I've done a lot of work to get here mentally, emotionally, spiritually. You know a lot of people do not want to do that work in order to access what they have.

How did you navigate your route.. you didn't go along a traditional route to become a professional opera singer .. you kind of again took chances?

I didn't have a choice. I applied to all the colleges but didn't get into any of them. So I had to think how I would do things differently? I went to a famous opera consultant and I thought she would advise me and tell me what needs to be done etc. But actually she saw me for 10 minutes and then said to me "you'll never sing opera. Go and sing jazz". So I went "OK then",  and ended up in Rock school for a year and did a diploma in Vocal Performance and sang pop songs for a year. I wrote an album, formed a band and we had a night at the Sound club in Trafalgar Square.

I had an opportunity to bring other artists on the scene to share our stage, so they could have a place to practice. At the end of the year I thought  "I've done this, I've got this album it's selling on iTunes so why can't I be an opera singer? This is ridiculous!".  So I wrote myself a business plan and I sent it off to 150 people. I literally did the whole lot and one woman came back to me, and she sponsored me for three years in a row. That way I was able to pick all my own teachers whilst working on stage at the same time. I was able to craft my skills the way I needed to.

And that's because you didn't take 'no'..

Yes. But I did get diverted when she said to me "go and sing jazz". I felt that maybe I wouldn't be able to be an opera singer because "she knew better than me". And that's the other thing. When we haven't "crossed over" we always think that people know better than us because we've never experienced it before. But all we need is already inside us, if we listen. That's why we have got to trust ourselves and recognise the people that we are approaching for advice are there so we can make a choice of where we want to go.  

What's the name of the album that you cut?

It was called 'Fish'.  Oh my gosh it was so long ago it's hilarious. Oh my gosh! (laughs)

Have you listened to it recently?

No.  It is still online.  It was released in 2007. I wrote every single one of these songs. What she said to me was an absolute perception for her but not my reality. 

You have touched on challenging times and how you've come through them ... the force of your own will

Yes, a will that's under divine faith. It's not just me.  It is me making decisions, but also listening to mentors as well and trusting my own instincts.

So how would you advise a younger person who's maybe in a position like yourself - when you were younger - who wants to achieve something but doesn't know the questions to ask and doesn't have anyone around them they feel they can approach. How do they find a mentor?

I think it's really important to read about the people that have done what they want to do. Watch videos of them. Ask questions about them and if they are still alive, find a way to write to them. Contact them through their agent. Also, write a plan of what you think you need to do and bring it to someone who is in business who can help mould the plan to draw out your vision.  This is really important!

That's a personal plan? Someone reading this might think 'I'm not starting a business'

No. A personal plan is still a business plan. You are still asking yourself what are the results going to be? Where will I be in five years time? What am I hoping to earn? Who am I hoping to meet? What am I hoping to see? What am I hoping to feel? You know all of those questions. A business wouldn't go for a year without structure. Why should we?

English National Opera rehearsals: Nadine Benjamin sings 'Summertime' from Porgy and Bess. The Ensemble of Porgy And Bess won the Olivier Award for Outstanding Achievement in Opera (7th April 2019):